The pavilion in question is an open-air building with long benches looking out to the Atlantic Ocean. It is owned by the Ocean Grove Camp Meeting Association.Gay "marriage" supporters will brook no dissent, and will allow no space in which anyone is permitted to dissent from their viewpoints.
"A building very similar to this has been on this site since the late 1800s," says the Rev. Scott Hoffman, the group's administrator.
During the summers, Hoffman says, the pavilion is used for Bible studies, church services, gospel choir performances and, in the past at least, weddings. Heterosexual weddings.
When Bernstein and Paster asked to celebrate their civil union in the pavilion, the Methodist organization said they could marry on the boardwalk — anywhere but buildings used for religious purposes. In other words, not the pavilion. Hoffman says there was a theological principle at stake.
"The principle was a strongly held religious belief that a marriage is between a man and a woman," Hoffman says. "We're not casting any aspersions or making any judgments. It's just, that's where we stand, and we've always stood that way, and that's why we said no."
The refusal came as a shock to Bernstein, who says Ocean Grove has been revived by the gay community.
"We were crushed," she says. "I lived my whole live, fortunately, without having any overt prejudices or discrimination waged against me. So while I knew it was wrong, I never knew how it felt. And after this, I did know how that felt. It was extremely painful."
Luisa says that initially, they walked away from the situation. "We were so stunned, we didn't know what to do. But as we came out of our initial shocked stage, we began to get a little angry. We felt an injustice had been done," she says.
So the couple filed a complaint with New Jersey's Division of Civil Rights, alleging the Methodists unlawfully discriminated against them based on sexual orientation. Attorney Lawrence Lustberg represents them.
"Our law against discrimination does not allow [the group] to use those personal preferences, no matter how deeply held, and no matter — even if they're religiously based — as a grounds to discriminate," Lustberg says. "Religion shouldn't be about violating the law."
The Methodist organization responded that it was their property, and the First Amendment protects their right to practice their faith without government intrusion. But Lustberg countered that the pavilion is open to everyone — and therefore the group could no more refuse to accommodate the lesbians than a restaurant owner could refuse to serve a black man. That argument carried the day. The state revoked the organization's tax exemption for the pavilion area. Hoffman figures they will lose $20,000.
This was illustrated for me very personally this week when a New Jersey newspaper quoted this blog in its print and on-line editions, as part of a roundup of blog posts about gay "marriage". I, of course, was the token opponent.
The comments I got from ardent New Jersey homosexuals were abusive, threatening, and made no attempt to answer my points. Instead, having looked at my profile picture, one commenter judged me by my appearance, calling me "fat", a description he alternated with "bigot".
These people feel entitled not only to what they say they want, but also to your allegiance to their viewpoint. Dissenters are bigots, and therefore less than people.
Persecution has begun, and will only increase. The culture war is a real war, with real lives at stake. Defeat is not an option.











































14 comments:
Does anyone still want to say I'm wrong?
Technically speaking, yes. I want to say you're wrong. However, since I strive to live in the real world instead of my fantasies, I cannot. For me as a non-Catholic this is evil in a way that a priest agreeing to perform homosexual marriages is not.
May the property of Bernstein and Paster be used for purposes they consider immortal - after the Supreme Court squashes this flat.
I think it's reprehensible that anyone uses an ad hominem attack, including those that called you "fat" and made fun of your appearance.
That said, I think it doesn't help matters when you make fun of opponents by calling them "stupid". Your blog (and blogs in general) are much more interesting when people focus on the merits of the arguments themselves and not resort to any ad hominem attacks.
YMMV.
I try to answer courtesy and reason with courtesy and reason.
But as with bullies in school (which, to my mind the internet much resembles), I find it efficacious to reply with contempt and hostility to those who display contempt and hostility.
It worked in junior high.
"Persecution has begun, and will only increase. The culture war is a real war, with real lives at stake. Defeat is not an option."
Amen brother, the battle lines are being drawn and there's no room for fencesitters or those who belong to the First National Church of "I'm okay, you're okay and can't we all just get along."
Time to lead, follow or get the **** out of the way.
Hmm. I still think you are wrong. Catholic Churches aren't forced to marry anyone right now, whether its a divorced person or a non-Catholic, or whatever. I think they may try, but they won't suceed.
On the other hand some renegade liberal priests may perform gay "marriages", another issue altogether. Hopefully the Bishops will keep that from happening, but I wouldn't bet the farm on that.
Kevin, I'd really rather you're right about this, but if it can happen to Methodists, why can't it happen to the Cathlolics. All it needs is for one judge to declare Catholic churches to be places of "public accomodation," and they're in.
Is it time for Pope Benedict to call a Crusades? Not a bloody one, but one nonetheless.
Oh we're not being forced to perform that abomination...yet. The same people behind the militant "gay" agenda are the same people who sent Jews to the death camps.
We've seen this before from the enemies of God, but where are the Sodomites, Philestines and Babylonians etc now?
How "gay" marriage hurts me? Let me count the ways.
Catholic churches are not places of public accomodation. Never have been.
The same people behind the militant "gay" agenda are the same people who sent Jews to the death camps.
No. I can tell you one good thing about the Nazis. They are, for the most part, dead. Those that aren't dead are extremely old.
You can say it's the same ideology (although you'll have a really tough time making that point). You can say they are both inspired by the same demons. But they aren't the same people.
Agreed with you dead on...we're the good in the battle against evil...Let's fight for what we believe in.
Hi Paul, just started reading your blog, good stuff. I, for one, would love to say you are wrong, but am over-ridden by my desire to be truthful. More than likely the government, by which I really mean a liberal judge presiding over a case brought by the ACLU, will not make a direct attack on the Catholic Church's doctrine, but rather alter the tax structure, such as revoking the exemption to pay certain taxes for all churches which refuse to marry homosexuals.
I just started reading your blog and I'm 100% behind you in your views. I think because Catholic Churches aren't available for any group to "rent" or borrow, the courts will have a tough time forcing priests to do this. However, I've never been confused with a prophet (I once announced no one would want email!) so who knows!
I think it would have to be a particularly carefully chosen test case for a judge to *in good faith* declare that Catholic churches are places of public accommodation.
My parish, for instance, would be a very poor test case. They do not rent out the church. I even asked if my fiancé and I, both parishioners, could rent the social hall for our wedding reception. No dice.
Getting married at our parish does not have a rental fee, though we are asked to make a donation.
If you had a parish that habitually rented out its facilities for weddings but refused to rent them out for a gay ceremony, a la the Methodist church, I think they would be quickly stripped of their tax-exempt status. If you're in the habit of letting other people buy access to your facilities, it's hard to argue that you're not a "place of public accommodation". If you closely control who has access to your facilities, and do not require that money change hands for use of them, it's harder to tie to commerce (which, believe it or not, is the linchpin of the Civil Rights Act).
I remember having a conversation with a lesbian of my acquaintance about five years ago, in which we were debating the relative merits of marriage v. civil unions. I said at the time that I didn't really care if some churches chose to perform gay marriage ceremonies, but that if the law was changed I was concerned that churches would be forced to perform such ceremonies. She tsked considerably and said - and I've never forgotten this - "No one's talking about FORCING anyone to do anything!"
I'd like to know what she'd say in response to the case of the Methodist facility in New Jersey.
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